Women and the church an answer to Opinionated Man

Mary Magdalen

Opinionated Man has posted that women should not be priests. His argument is that is doesn’t feel right. This is an argument that I have also had with the husband for years. His argument? Well Peter left his wife to follow Jesus so they are the only ones that should be priests. The Pope said so and he is infallible. These misogynistic attitudes have permeated the church for centuries.

Women and their roles in the church have been subject to propaganda including the early female leaders being removed from the Bible. Mary Magdalene in new research in newly discovered early texts may have been one of Christ’s disciples, one of prominence. New Testament gospels written in the early years of the church acknowledge that women were among the first of Jesus’s followers. Mary Magdalene, Joanna and Susanna accompanied Jesus during his early ministry and even financed some of it. (Luke 8:1-3). He was even taught by an unnamed Gentile woman that the ministry of God is not limited but belongs to all who have faith (Mark 7:24; Matthew 15:21-28). He was a frequent visitor to the house of Martha and taught and ate with the women of that house. Women were the first witnesses of the resurrection and none turned on him. Actually none of his followers did according to new research on the character of Judas but we will save that for another day.

Look at the church today who are the ones that give it the most support? Who take care of the fundraisers? The charitable works? The women.  As in the early days of the church they play prominent roles. As a matter of fact scholars have suggested that the majority of early Christians were women.

In the Gospel of Philip, Mary Magdalene is one of the three women who walked with the lord as his companion. In the Pistis Sophia she is again preeminent among the disciples. In the Gospel of Mary she is a leader among the disciples.

So how did Mary Magdalene and the women of the early church get pushed aside as leaders and priests? I suspect there was a power struggle in the early church. Women had too much authority. Those that felt that women were not staying in the roles of support that the early church thought they should be in did a little rewriting of history. Instead of a leader Mary Magdalene in the Fourth Century is made into a woman of ill repute that converts. This was due to a confusion between Mary Magdalene and the unnamed sinner who anointed Jesus’s feet (Luke 7:36-50). Think about it if you want to besmirch a woman and bring her down what is the first claim you make. She has also been confused with several other women in the bible  (John 12:18) Mary of Bethany. Also during the middle ages land was left to male heirs not women. When priests would come into the church their worldly goods would become the church’s. They were not allowed to marry for the same reason. How do you think the church became rich?

I don’t mind if you have an opinion but I do have a problem with prejudice. That is why my husband goes out to church and I don’t. Thank you but if I am not good enough to be a leader in your church then I will take my talents elsewhere.

Thank you OM. I enjoyed refuting your arguments. I admire your belief in your church but it should not blind you to facts.

45 comments

  1. Kate · March 31, 2015

    Well said.

    Liked by 1 person

  2. jennydevildoll · March 31, 2015

    Yes, this is why I didn’t stay a Catholic, among other reasons. Though Hildegard von Bingen I’ll always view as a genius regardless. Touch of irony?

    Liked by 2 people

    • Gale A. Molinari · March 31, 2015

      We can admire others without sharing their views. I like Opinionated Man but se don’t always share the same views but he always makes me think. I like that.

      Liked by 5 people

    • Donna from MyOBT · March 31, 2015

      Jenny, I’m right there with you on both counts! The Catholics lost me, but I would pledge my troth to Hildegard!

      Like

  3. Kanika Tripathi · March 31, 2015

    I don’t know whatever it is all about, my friend, but women have all the rights to be anything they want. I will say nothing more.

    Liked by 3 people

    • Gale A. Molinari · March 31, 2015

      Not in the church they don’t and in a lot of places in the world they are nothing but property. Just because women have fought and gained some freedoms doesn’t mean all women are free.

      Like

      • Kanika Tripathi · March 31, 2015

        Hmm..something to ponder over. I don’t like the thought of it! But this is how it is, and I would agree too that women are still not free in certain parts of the world.
        However, thoughts alone are not enough here, and neither are words.
        What this world needs is evolution! To evolve into something worth evolving into. Thanks for the pose, it’s generating a reaction.

        Liked by 1 person

      • Gale A. Molinari · March 31, 2015

        All I am saying is that people should be seen for what they are not what they look like or their gender.

        Liked by 1 person

      • Kanika Tripathi · March 31, 2015

        Absolutely! What I think is that we are still not “thinking people”. We follow like fools without thinking or reasoning.

        Liked by 1 person

  4. Opinionated Man · March 31, 2015

    Reblogged this on HarsH ReaLiTy and commented:
    Actually my opinion was that it is based on tradition. Which it is. That’s ok, you don’t have to attend my church. We are doing just fine. 🙂 If I had a dollar every time someone called me a misogynist I’d be a billionaire.
    Note: Comments disabled here, please visit their post.

    Liked by 3 people

    • Gale A. Molinari · April 1, 2015

      We agree to disagree but you know I will back up my arguments. Yes I know you are a misogynist that is your shtick. I like you anyway. Thanks for the prompt!! Once again I learn from you even when I totally disagree!!

      Liked by 2 people

  5. Rebecca Meyer · March 31, 2015

    I love tang you wrote this. My favorite part of your post is this line: “I don’t mind if you have an opinion but I do have a problem with prejudice.” I couldn’t agree more. I understand when people have different opinions, but the fact that some believe women cannot hold high titles in a church is just prejudged, simple as that. If it’s “tradition,” I’d argue it’s done out of fear of change.

    Like

    • Gale A. Molinari · April 1, 2015

      Whose tradition? In my opinion it is the tradition of those that wrote women out of the church and placed them in a subservient role. Tradition is a weak argument in my view.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Rebecca Meyer · April 1, 2015

        Good point! I think that the only people who say it’s “tradition” are men who have perpetuated their prejudice against women. Tradition is just the excuse they use in order to continue their sexism.

        Liked by 2 people

      • Gale A. Molinari · April 1, 2015

        Exactly.

        Liked by 1 person

      • Rebecca Meyer · April 1, 2015

        I’m glad that you wrote this, because I think it’s important for people to know that it’s just sexism for churches to not allow women to be preachers.

        Liked by 1 person

      • Gale A. Molinari · April 1, 2015

        I don’t think gender should be a consideration in any leader. Particularly religious. Don’t think it has anything to do with the ability to lead anything.

        Liked by 1 person

      • Rebecca Meyer · April 1, 2015

        I completely agree. When people make arguments that it matters, I think they’re just trying to hide their sexism.

        Like

  6. Fiona · April 1, 2015

    Well put, and well defended. I remain astounded, and I supposed I shouldn’t be, that so many people are oblivious of the fact that there are millions of women around the world who have few, if any rights. Based on tradition. Don’t get me wrong, I like tradition – in its place. And those traditions that are prejudicial and disrespectful of a person’s humanity have no place.

    Liked by 2 people

  7. Gale A. Molinari · April 1, 2015

    I am honored by your reblog!

    Liked by 1 person

  8. speedyrabbit · April 1, 2015

    Actually Most religions throughout history put women as priestess and High priestess the faiths that were around each era.as for Christianity as it is today it was created by Constatine,who was know to be anti women,it was under his instruction the the bible was translated from the Hebrew language.so it was down to him the we were given subservient roles.personally I don’t Believe in any religion as it is “man” made,I ama Spirtual person who believes in the balance of life and nature and I believe that there is something more than what were are and for the want of a better word its called God or Godess because we will never know it it is male or female…so I guess that makes me more of a pagan.Its not very often I make comments of my own,its normally my Bunny Speedy who does this but this is more my topic,xx Rachel Speedy’s mum

    Like

    • Gale A. Molinari · April 1, 2015

      Before Christianity Women were really the central force in religion. I think the men were afraid they would become too powerful. You are right about Constantine. He was another twisted person they made him a saint though as they owed him big time.

      Liked by 1 person

  9. 80smetalman · April 2, 2015

    Deborah in the Book of Judges is a prime example of God using a woman to do his will.

    Liked by 1 person

  10. wildero64 · June 3, 2015

    I really love how you have this disagreement with OM but still remain on good terms! That’s how it should be!

    Liked by 1 person

  11. marilynmunrow · April 12, 2016

    Reblogged this on Marilyn Munrow and commented:
    Wow I admire and applaud you

    Liked by 2 people

    • Gale A. Molinari · April 12, 2016

      Thank you and for the reblog. I really like OM he makes you think even if we sometimes disagree.

      Like

  12. Robert Matthew Goldstein · April 16, 2016

    As a San Franciscan I have the privilege of living in the kind of world that
    seems to terrify many U.S. citizens.

    It is a world of unisex bathrooms. open discussions of the needs of transgenders,
    where same sex couples have openly lived in Domestic Partnership for close to two
    decades and where I can attend a Mass in which the celebrant is a woman.

    Please understand that I’m not saying San Fransisco is a liberal utopia; it isn’t.
    When it comes to the evil of economic injustice San Francisco is just as rotten as
    the rest of the U.S.

    I guess that many Catholics don’t know that woman can function as a priest even if
    that isn’t the title she has:

    “The Diocesan Bishop, in his role as moderator of the liturgical life in the diocese entrusted to his care, has the authority, within the boundaries of the territory entrusted to his care, to permit women to serve at the altar.”

    http://www.womenpriests.org/traditio/servers.asp

    When I went through my conversion the importance of women in the Gospel was emphasized.

    Mary, the Mother of Jesus was referred to as the first disciple.

    In principle Magdalene was as much a disciple as Peter and John.

    Who is the first person to lay eyes on the risen Christ?

    She was certainly more important to the ministry of Christ than Saul of Tarsus.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Gale A. Molinari · April 17, 2016

      I never understood why anyone cares how another person chooses to live their life or who they love. You would think we would have enough to do trying to live a good life whether that is a belief in God or not. Women are the vessel that brings life into the world. It is a kind of magic that I think has frightened men for millennia. They have tried everything to control them. It is a shame that we cannot see each other as human and divine in our own way. Honestly organized religion turns me off. I don’t care what other people do but it just isn’t for me. My husband is a practicing Catholic. He does his thing I do mine.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Robert Matthew Goldstein · April 17, 2016

        I agree with you. I actually think that most of the progressive movement is an unfolding of the way we understand out humanity as a species.

        People who need to define who is human and who isn’t have the right to set limits in their private lives.

        The basic premise of American Democracy is that no one has the right to limit another person’s right to personal autonomy.

        I don’t consider the hoarding of resources as a personal right because as a behavior it damages other people whereas two men getting married does no damage at all the the private life of a fundamentalist Christian who will always have the freedom to lock gays out of their homes.

        It’s a simple and elegant social contract which is a bit like what you describe about your relationship with your husband’s Catholicism.

        Liked by 1 person

      • Gale A. Molinari · April 18, 2016

        Exactly.

        Liked by 1 person

  13. Robert Matthew Goldstein · April 16, 2016

    Reblogged this on Art by Rob Goldstein and commented:
    I’m going to re-blog this because I think it’s a good discussion, more so because you respectfully disagree.

    What do you folks think?

    Liked by 1 person

    • Gale A. Molinari · April 17, 2016

      Thank you for the reblog I never disrespect anyone I disagree with. I have the highest respect for Opinionated Man. We don’t agree a lot of times but he makes you think. I like that in a person.

      Liked by 1 person

  14. sonofabeach96 · April 16, 2016

    I’ve never understood the rigid stance on women, birth control, homosexuality, or requiring priests to be celibate/not allowed to marry. I was raised a Catholic, went to Catholic schools from third grad through high school. Still don’t understand. I’m not a church goer, finding organized religion overbearing and hypocritical. But when we had our boys baptized, it was in an Episcopal church…by a female priest.

    Liked by 1 person

  15. Br Andrew Efo · April 16, 2016

    Women the divorced those whose sex or gender is not politically correct, the lame the halt and the deaf and blind, those wheelchair bound and more, are all excluded from Priesthood in the Catholic Church. I left it because I was a woman who is divorced, had a sex change and has remarried without an annulment. I have been ordained in an Independent Church by a Celtic Bishop, our Community will ordain anyone – I have Bipolar Affective Disorder and Epilepsy – who can be presented by a congregation for ordination.

    PROBLEM for the main part Christians want the trimmings and security of Mainstream Church with the freedom of Independence.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Gale A. Molinari · April 17, 2016

      I think it is the reason that many have left the church. People don’t just blindly follow religion as much as they used to. They are also better educated particularly women. Guess it was a bummer for the church when we were allowed to learn to read.

      Liked by 1 person

    • Gale A. Molinari · April 17, 2016

      By the way my mother was bipolar and brilliant. I am glad you have found your path. It isn’t easy when you have bipolar as a challenge.

      Like

  16. Keith · April 17, 2016

    Good post. Your comment about the church inheriting male heirs’ wealth is critical. This is also a reason, I believe, why priests were no longer allowed to be married after 1100 AD or so. Offspring might have inherited wealth that could remain with the church. I do not mean to be so cynical, but this is a reason why I hold Pope Francis in high regard as he is returning the church to focus on those in need.

    Like

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